SPEAKER_02 0:01

All right, we're recording. It's live.

SPEAKER_01 0:05

Um at each other, but the wedding made it so. Now we're stuck together with nowhere else to go. This is legally friends. We're in law to build a family team. Legally friends, you're related to us.

SPEAKER_02 0:24

Legally, I think, I think Amy, you've got to do the intro for this one.

SPEAKER_00 0:29

Okay, ready?

SPEAKER_02 0:30

Yep. Give it to us.

SPEAKER_00 0:33

Welcome back to Legally Friends. We are your hosts, Amy and Zach, and we are so graciously joined by the one, the only Michael Scala.

SPEAKER_02 0:44

Graciously joined?

SPEAKER_00 0:46

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 0:47

Blessing us with his presence.

SPEAKER_00 0:49

You like truly are blessing us with your presence, Michael. How does that feel?

SPEAKER_04 0:54

Uh I need full full disclosure, I'm here against my will. So if I if I blink three times or Morse code or something, send help. Somebody rescue me.

SPEAKER_00 1:07

Whatever. Don't act like you don't love it.

SPEAKER_04 1:09

This is weird. I can hear you guys, but I can't hear myself talk, so I don't know what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_02 1:14

Well, this is the full unfiltered, unedited version.

SPEAKER_00 1:18

Michael, just put one headphone back like that so you can hear yourself.

SPEAKER_04 1:22

Put it in the back. Oh, yeah, that's better.

SPEAKER_00 1:24

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:25

All right.

unknown 1:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:26

That's a little better. A little uncomfortable, though. All right. Good to be here with legally friends.

SPEAKER_02 1:32

And uh, we're gonna jump right into a couple questions, though. For you. And then we'll get more into more about more about Michael, about the man who raised the Scala sisters.

SPEAKER_00 1:43

Um what a legend.

SPEAKER_02 1:45

Don't blame me.

SPEAKER_00 1:47

We blame you, Michael.

SPEAKER_02 1:49

And I'm gonna say the most patient man on the face of the earth is is is Mike Scala. Um, so first question though. Who was the hardest daughter to raise?

SPEAKER_04 2:02

Uh I've got to go with Amy. We're still raising Amy.

SPEAKER_00 2:06

Michael! That is so rude. You're saying I was harder to raise than Emily.

SPEAKER_04 2:14

The other daughters, well, you're never done, but you're somewhat done when they get married. So Rachel, 19. Really? Yeah, that's crazy. We let it get married or let Drew marry her at 19. Emily was how old, 20 or 21?

SPEAKER_00 2:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 2:30

Yeah. And Megan. How old was Megan? 24.

SPEAKER_02 2:36

23.

SPEAKER_04 2:37

23.

SPEAKER_02 2:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 2:39

And Amy still keeping a close eye on her mother.

SPEAKER_00 2:44

Womp, womp.

SPEAKER_02 2:46

Yep. So that that's so you're saying Amy's the toughest because she's still being raised. She's she's still in the house.

SPEAKER_04 2:54

Probably the most stubborn, too. I think you guys talked about that the other day. Yeah. So true. That that picture of you with your arms folded, the defiant look, the the dance picture, and Megan's just bright and beaming and smiling, and you're you're saying, get me out of here. I'm not doing it.

SPEAKER_00 3:14

Yeah, that says it all perfectly depicts our personalities.

SPEAKER_02 3:22

That was how Amy was the whole time. Like as soon as she come came out, that was Amy and all the way till now. Would you is that how kind of how it was raising Amy?

SPEAKER_04 3:30

Yeah, kind of her personality. Yeah. I mean, at times. At her times she's charming.

SPEAKER_00 3:40

Oh, thank you.

SPEAKER_02 3:42

No, Amy's definitely the funniest for sure. Um, I would agree with that. Next question is kind of tough. You know, you can plead the fifth on some of these.

SPEAKER_04 3:52

I I may to protect the innocent me.

SPEAKER_02 3:55

Who spent the must most money growing up? Amy. That makes it youngest child. Youngest child. Yeah. I would agree. I think I was the most spil spoiled in my family too, and I was the youngest, so I mean that's I think it's natural.

SPEAKER_04 4:13

Youngest, yeah. The youngest or the younger, they I mean, yeah, we were very strict with Emily. Tried to be with Rachel, but less so, and then Megan and Amy, the the babies we called them all growing up, the babies, they were they should have been twins.

SPEAKER_03 4:30

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 4:31

But uh, yeah, I don't know if we were worn out, worn down.

SPEAKER_00 4:37

Or you just didn't care. You're like, yeah, whatever.

SPEAKER_04 4:40

Oh no, we cared, but we weren't we weren't nearly as uptight about things, you know? Like it's not the end of the world.

SPEAKER_02 4:52

What what were Megan and Amy typically asking for? Like, because I know uh asking? Yeah, well that's what were they typically wanting?

SPEAKER_04 5:03

What's the statute of limitations on check forgery? We know is it is it eight years? If it's ten years, there may still be a problem, but if it's eight, maybe you're okay. But ain't it?

SPEAKER_00 5:16

Michael, you're spilling all my secrets.

SPEAKER_04 5:20

This is great. This is great. Oh, and I would catch her or find out, and uh that's probably where my blood pressure issues start. So tell me how this happened.

SPEAKER_00 5:33

So let's go back a little bit. So I had like a debit card, and sometimes I would run out of money and I'd be like, oh, what the heck? I need money. And a lot of times Shannon wasn't home because she was either like driving Megan to dance or she was like off busy, and I'm like rummaging around their house trying to find money, and I stumble upon a gold mine, and it was Michael's checkbook.

SPEAKER_04 5:58

But you would forge your mother's signature, you'd put SS.

SPEAKER_00 6:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 6:03

Never mind.

SPEAKER_00 6:03

I also I don't know, I never learned how to write in cursive. So like I don't know how to do like a legit signature, but Shannon, when she does her signature, it's literally just like two big S's. And so I was like, okay, it's just gonna be a one-time thing.

SPEAKER_04 6:19

Like Easily forged. Yeah. So I I wrote myself a checkbook. One time thing.

SPEAKER_00 6:24

And then Michael gets the checkbook, and he's like, you know how you like go through and you can see the statement.

SPEAKER_04 6:29

Yeah, you're reconciling every month.

SPEAKER_00 6:32

Well, no, no, it this was before the pictures. This was when you would go back into the checkbook and you would see what was written before. Carbon copy.

SPEAKER_04 6:41

I love carbon copy.

SPEAKER_00 6:42

He was like, Who who he was like, Shannon, did you write Amy a hundred dollar check? Like, why like this is so dumb? Why are you writing her a hundred dollar checks?

SPEAKER_04 6:50

That's back when a hundred dollars was a lot of money. Seriously.

SPEAKER_00 6:54

So then I figured out, okay, if I use a pen, it's gonna show up on the checkbook. So then I started using a marker because it wouldn't show up underneath, but then it would show up in the pictures. You know how they send pictures to like your email or whatever? Yeah.

unknown 7:12

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 7:13

No, those were good times. That was like my senior year of high school, and it was just like $50 here. Oh, I have to go to In N Out, $20 there. Like you guys, that's the evil. Like, that is so that is wild.

SPEAKER_02 7:26

And once again, this is why he's the most patient man, I feel like.

SPEAKER_04 7:30

Yes, moving on.

SPEAKER_02 7:32

Yes, next one question.

SPEAKER_00 7:33

But to be clear, I was not writing myself like thousands of dollars worth of books. To be clear.

SPEAKER_02 7:39

In aggregate, bro, you know, it was get adding up quickly with those $50 year, $100.

SPEAKER_00 7:46

Yeah, it all adds up, but like we're not we're not doing math here.

SPEAKER_02 7:49

But I think this answers my next question because it was gonna be who knew how to work you the best.

SPEAKER_04 7:55

Man, do we go three for three on Amy?

SPEAKER_02 7:57

I might be.

SPEAKER_04 7:58

I don't know. All all of them had their moments. But I mean when it comes right down to it, you know, I like to act tough and talk tough, but I'm I'm a wimp. Yeah, he's like when it comes to my daughters.

SPEAKER_00 8:12

Yeah, if if any of us ever need anything, he is the first one. For example, Isla calls me like 37 times and she's like, Mames, I am This is this this week. Yeah, this was like on Monday or Tuesday, Tuesday, and she was like, I am starving, my mom's not answering, please let me DoorDash. And okay, also a little backstory. I had my door dash privileges removed because you did.

SPEAKER_04 8:39

Yeah, you were you deserved that.

SPEAKER_00 8:41

Yeah, I was going a little crazy on DoorDash. So I told Isla, I was like, Isla, I had my DoorDash privileges removed, so you need to call Papa. So she calls Papa and what I get a text. You're allowed to DoorDash Isla Rose food.

unknown 8:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 8:58

So yeah, the the granddaughters are even.

SPEAKER_00 9:01

So now he's been worked by the granddaughters. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:05

Yeah. I mean, I've seen it, but I don't, I don't know. He I think he's pretty uh relaxed for anybody that asks for help. It doesn't have to be just the daughters, it could be anybody. I feel like I've seen him do it with neighbors or whoever. It's my Mike's usually pretty easygoing and pretty nice to everybody.

SPEAKER_00 9:24

He is the most generous person in the world.

SPEAKER_04 9:28

Uh I'm under doctor's orders now to not get my blood pressure up or Shannon Shannon orders too.

SPEAKER_02 9:36

Yeah, which is the doctor of the scholarhouse. She's the best doctor in the family. It's true.

SPEAKER_00 9:42

She really comes in through with those diagnoses.

SPEAKER_02 9:46

Yes. Well, those are my hard-hitting questions to start. There's gonna be more of them, but uh let's get to more about you. Where did you grow up and what were you like before the the girls came around?

SPEAKER_04 10:03

So I grew up in a boy family. Uh I've got three brothers, so four boys and then youngest, uh, younger sister, who was the youngest, and and Carol, and she picked on her older brothers all growing up, but yeah, so four boys, and uh yeah, it was a boy house, man. We so I I uh lived in mostly in Sheridan, Wyoming, Bighorn Mountains, Northern Wyoming, right on the Montana border, till I was 11. We moved to the big city, Omaha, Nebraska, when I was 11. And so quick story there. I was ready to be the big man on campus, Lyndon Elementary School in Sheridan, Wyoming, sixth grader. We were gonna rule the school, and then that summer uh we moved to Omaha, and uh we got there in August. Lo and behold, uh sixth graders went to junior high or middle school. It was sixth through ninth. So I'm the little kid in a huge uh middle school, sixth, seventh, eighth, and ninth grades. And tell you what, to this day, I'm still scared to death of ninth graders. They were frightening, scary to a little Wyoming kid. But survived ninth grade or survived sixth grade and and uh went through. So yeah, I went to uh junior high and high school in Omaha. Uh great, great place to grow up. Um, best thing about Omaha, you got one week of good weather in the spring, one week of good weather in the fall. But uh Nebraska football, uh all of that. We just a great place to uh grow up. We had a great house that backed onto a big, uh huge linear drainage type park. And uh man, we we built dams, uh we uh explored the the tunnels, uh storm-drained tunnels.

SPEAKER_00 12:09

Did it like you or your friends like almost die in one of the tunnels? Like you guys almost drown or something.

SPEAKER_04 12:15

Yeah, we had torches and we went way back in the tunnels, and we're still not sure if it I don't think it rained, but somehow a bunch of water got uh discharged, and and uh that as you go way back, the tunnels get narrower and narrower, and you know, pretty soon you're crawling, and all of a sudden this water starts roaring in, and so we had to mad dash back out of the uh storm drain tunnels, and it it got a little bit uh exciting or uh probably dangerous, but uh so you're in sixth grade.

SPEAKER_00 12:48

Imagine like Canon, Minty, and Lucas doing that. Like that is so frightening to me.

SPEAKER_04 12:54

Yeah, this is probably a little later. This was probably I was probably 14, 15.

SPEAKER_00 13:00

Okay, well that's capri.

SPEAKER_04 13:01

I I was fifteen because I remember the day that uh that it happened. It was when you have to tell that story when my dad was uh baptized into the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

SPEAKER_00 13:17

And what did what did your friend say?

SPEAKER_04 13:19

We oh yeah, we were back in the tunnel and trying to get out, and this water keeps raising and raising, and and our torches had had gone out or been extinguished, and it was my friend Steve, and and all my friends called my dad uh Pappy, Pappy Scala. So we we I I know we're we're not gonna die, we can't die. It's Pappy Scala's getting baptized today, and so we made it out, and uh yeah, lots of scrapes and bruises. My younger brother had blood running down his head where he smacked, you know, running out of the tunnels, smacked into the walls. But anyway, that's the short version of that story. We we made it out, and I don't think I went back in after that.

SPEAKER_00 14:04

It was well, yeah, I went out.

SPEAKER_04 14:07

But yeah, we had a great time.

SPEAKER_00 14:08

Uh we were my parents were it's kind of the definition of free-range parenting, and uh well, you were allowed to be back in those days, you can't do that these days, so you're just let loose.

SPEAKER_04 14:22

Yeah, our house was the hangout house where all the everybody congregated, and you know, we had some wild, we had Friday night boxing matches. Uh, you know, we'd go break into the uh church and play basketball sometimes all night. And uh anyway, we yeah, we had a great, great childhood. Uh best day of our lives was when our mother was called to be the Relief Society president over a large ward, so she's in charge, responsible for all of the women, kind of almost equivalent to a bishop in the congregation. And so, you know, the ward boundaries were all the way from the Missouri River downtown Omaha, all the way out to the west suburbs where we lived. And so she was always delivering meals or helping somebody at the hospital or whatever. So the minute she was called, you know, we knew what that meant. There would be a lot less adult supervision around the house, and we we took full advantage. Uh, I mean, we worked, we had paper routes growing up, and then uh uh we started lawn businesses. Uh one time a friend and I, and we'd hire our younger brothers. Uh, we were cutting probably 30 to 35 lawn per week. We'd do aeration, we didn't do fertilizer or anything like that, but uh lawn cutting, and that's what uh financed college and mission and things like that. So, yeah, a great place to uh grow up. I I took uh three granddaughters back to Omaha when a month ago for a uh dance convention. So Capri, Isla Rose, and London, and they had some time uh Saturday afternoon, and so I made them, I took them on the mandatory tour of Omaha.

SPEAKER_00 16:12

Yes, saw the house. Can you show them your old stomping grounds?

SPEAKER_04 16:15

So the house where I grew up, uh the park, they we got out uh behind our house that I grew up in, and they played in the park for a while, drove past my old high school, Burke High School in Omaha. That's really cool. Saw all of the sites. Warren Buffett's home that he's owned since the 50s in Omaha. That is pretty wild. The Oracle of Omaha.

SPEAKER_00 16:39

Is that really what they call it, or is that what you call it?

SPEAKER_04 16:41

No, that's what they call Warren Buffett. Yeah. The Oracle of Omaha. Oh, okay. Probably the greatest, most successful investor of all time.

SPEAKER_02 16:50

Did you ever see him around town, around the city?

SPEAKER_04 16:52

Um, I didn't, but my dad did, and Shannon's father, uh Shannon's dad talked about you know, riding up the elevator with Warren Buffett at uh Kiwit Plaza. That's okay. And uh his offices were in the Kewit Plaza, and then the Berkshire offices were right across the street. But he and the CEO of uh Kiwit, uh Walter Scott Jr. and Peter Kiwit Jr., when he was alive, uh they were all very, very tight, very good friends and kind of built Omaha. Uh you know, invested a lot into the community. And so you want to know something crazy. That's cool.

SPEAKER_00 17:27

Speaking of Kewit, I remember back in like the day when I was like 20 in my prime. Um I was I was talking to this guy who was a construction major at BYU, and he was like, What does your dad do? Whatever. So I was like explaining to him what you and Papa and other Papa do. And I was like, Yeah, both my grandparents they used to work for Kiwit. Have you heard of Kiwit? And he was like, No, I've never heard of Kewit. And it like genuinely blew my mind that he had never heard of Kiwit. I'm like, How are you a construction major and you've never heard of Kiwit?

SPEAKER_03 18:05

It was no second date.

SPEAKER_00 18:07

And then I realized that like I feel like Kewit was like almost like like a third like parent or like a third grandparent in our family. Like it was always talked about.

SPEAKER_04 18:19

Yeah, a lot of influence. I I worked for Kewit for what 13, 14 years, uh during college and after.

SPEAKER_00 18:27

Well, and that's how you and Shannon met was because your both your parents worked for Kiwit.

SPEAKER_04 18:33

Well, neither of our fathers but they knew each other. They knew each other. I had to meet Shannon on my own.

SPEAKER_02 18:41

Yeah, let's hear about that.

SPEAKER_00 18:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 18:43

Well, all right. So the quick story is I had returned from my mission in Orange County, uh, Anaheim, California mission, Spanish speaking. I got home right before Christmas of that year. I won't tell you what year, that will definitely date me. But wasn't ready to jump back into BYU uh, you know, a week later or 10 days later. And so I stayed in Omaha for a semester, went to University of Nebraska, the Omaha campus, and Shannon's parents' family had moved to Omaha from Chicago. Uh big project that LD was on outside of Chicago ended. So they moved to Omaha the day after Shannon graduated from high school. And so this is what seven or eight months later, I get home, and and but even fast forward about three months, this would have been in March of this year. And it's a Saturday morning, I'm minding my own business, and my friend uh Don, uh Donnie calls me on the phone, uh the home phone, and says, Hey, Mike, there's uh there's a uh YSA dance across the river in Council Bluffs, Iowa tonight. We're going. I said, Donnie, we're no, we're we're not going to a YSA dance in Iowa. Sounds like going. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:08

That's where I get it from.

SPEAKER_04 20:09

Yeah. But you went. He kept working on me, and finally I said, All right, fine, we'll go. And you know, it was fine. But uh, right towards the end of the dance, like during the last song, here comes Donnie uh with this girl and comes over and introduced. I mean, big mistake, Donnie. He introduces us and said, Hey, you guys have something in common. He had made the connection, he and Shannon. I think he got introduced and they they danced, I think one dance or something, and came over and introduced us, and we made that connection that our fathers had worked together. But I wasn't the brightest guy.

SPEAKER_00 20:54

I didn't you're shy, you're a little shy guy.

SPEAKER_04 20:58

Yeah, yeah. I'm scared of girls still to this day. But uh, didn't get her number, and I couldn't, I think, and mom still gets mad at me, but I think I called her Lisa or something.

SPEAKER_03 21:10

I can't remember her name.

SPEAKER_02 21:13

That was on purpose. You're just playing the game, you know, yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_04 21:16

So the next day I'm at work and I call my younger brother Pete and said, Pete, I met this girl last night. Her dad works for Kiwit, he's in the underground, uh, the tunnels district, but I can't remember her last name. And so Kiwit has had this company magazine that came out once a month or once a quarter called the Kiwis magazine. Kiwi is a construction term, and so Pete is rifling through these magazines, looking at the uh underground district, trying to trying to find this name, and then all of a sudden my dad k walks in from work. Uh, in those days, Kiwit worked uh half a day Saturday. And the theory philosophy was while our competitors are on the golf course or on the lake, we're working half a day. And that was just the culture. And that's what I did as well. But so my dad walks in and sees all these company magazines spread about. And uh said, Pete, what in the world are you doing? And Pete said, Well, Mike met this girl whose dad works for Kiwit, can't remember her name, wants to get a hold of her, and works in the underground division, made her at this YSA dance. And uh my dad goes, Oh, yeah, that's old LD. I've known him for years. He's a great guy. There's not very many members of the church with Kiwit. They were, you know, they would be drinking their uh seven up drinks at a corporate function or company Christmas party when they were yeah, back in those days. So yeah, they had known each other, but we had to meet on our own through my friend Donnie. And so Donnie, to this day, I got the girl. Donnie is still mad at me to this day. We love that.

SPEAKER_00 23:06

Thanks, Donnie.

SPEAKER_02 23:08

That's awesome. So then what else she got? Well, first question how long was it from when you met and got married? Because you've had some daughters go through some quick situations, some marriage.

SPEAKER_00 23:20

Quick turnarounds here.

SPEAKER_04 23:22

We were both engaged one time, that's it. There was no calling it off. Nice, and uh and it was quick? Second start. We met, I I think it was about mid-March and uh dated that spring and summer, and then we both went out to BYU that fall. I'll tell you the year, it was 1984. That was a great year to be at BYU and to be a football fan. That's the uh national championship year. That still uh upsets you Utah fans. You say, oh, it's a mythical national championship, but hey, we're we're gonna count it.

SPEAKER_02 24:00

He's still holding on to that.

SPEAKER_04 24:02

Even though it was a few years, yep, holding on. And so we we dated that fall, uh, got engaged in January, got married uh July 30th, 1985.

SPEAKER_00 24:17

So we so it was like a year and a half all together, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 24:20

A little less than a year and a half, like I don't know, 16, 16 months from the time we met till the round up.

SPEAKER_00 24:29

You taught me that.

SPEAKER_04 24:30

Round up a year and a half, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:32

Unless you're shopping and spending money, then you always round down.

SPEAKER_02 24:36

Yes, you always round significantly down. Significantly. So you get married, you start having all of these girls. You come from an all-boy family, mostly boys, mostly boys, except Carol. So one sister. Yep. Um and I'm the second.

SPEAKER_04 24:57

Four boys, second of five kids.

SPEAKER_02 24:59

What so what was your I mean, I because a lot of people ask, what was it like raising four daughters? What was and and what was your parenting style? Because even I wonder that, you know, how is people are still trying to figure out how to raise their kids, want them to be successful, and obviously you've had pretty four successful daughters. Um how how did you do it? What was your approach?

SPEAKER_04 25:22

It's all a blur. A blur. No, once I've read somewhere that somebody wrote, uh, before I had kids, I had four theories of raising kids. Now I've got four daughters and no theories. So I I don't know if I could, I don't think I could uh narrow it down succinctly. Uh they're they're all different. Yeah, you have to kind of adapt, or and I don't know, maybe someone would say, well, you can't treat them differently, but in some ways you have to uh uh you know respond a little bit differently, and you know, some respond to the uh you know the tough love or the you know grumpy Michael, uh tough Michael, and others, you know, will burst into tears.

SPEAKER_02 26:19

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Michael, yeah, Megan, definitely Megan.

SPEAKER_00 26:24

Um can I tell you what I think a little bit? And Michael, tell me if this is wrong. I feel like a lot of times you guys always were like, nothing else matters except for your family. I I maybe that was more Shannon.

SPEAKER_04 26:44

Well, family's at the top, more important than friends, yes, and you know, it worked hard, so you know, I like I almost missed Megan's birth. I was up in Idaho on a business trip, and we had just arrived, and then I had to catch a flight right back, and uh got there just like two minutes to spare before Megan was born. But uh yeah, yeah, family is what it's all about. You've got to protect the family and relationships.

SPEAKER_00 27:19

I feel like that's how like your parents and mom's parents were too. It was all about family, and you do anything for your family, and there's really not a whole lot your family can do to like cross the line or I don't know. Like, do you do you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_04 27:38

Yeah, no, lots of lines get crossed these days, or even growing up, but which is not how it was, you know, in in my family. We didn't fight and argue. I mean, we we battled as brothers naturally do, but but uh you know, we didn't talk about our feelings. Uh, you know, the girls always said, Oh, you gotta talk about your feelings. So, you know, with my younger brother Bart, still to this day, a lot of times when we see each other, haven't been around each other for a while, I'll say, Bart, how are your feelings? Oh, they're fine. Mike, how are your feelings? Yep, I'm good. And then so we get that over and we move on. Michael, should we should we do this?

SPEAKER_00 28:19

Probably should we do our wellness check that I make you do?

SPEAKER_04 28:23

All right, do your wellness check.

SPEAKER_00 28:24

This is mine and Michael's wellness check. I do it a couple times a week with him. Okay, Michael, how are you?

SPEAKER_04 28:31

I'm fine.

SPEAKER_00 28:32

How are you mentally?

SPEAKER_04 28:34

Good.

SPEAKER_00 28:34

How are you physically?

SPEAKER_04 28:36

Good.

SPEAKER_00 28:38

How are you unfortunately?

SPEAKER_04 28:40

It's basketball night in America night tonight, and Canon has a game.

SPEAKER_00 28:44

So you're great.

SPEAKER_04 28:46

Physically, I'm doing great. And I got a workout in last night uh during the Utah Mammoth hockey game.

SPEAKER_00 28:52

So you guys, his gout.

SPEAKER_04 28:56

I will I need to hear about this.

SPEAKER_00 28:58

So I'm sitting there rhinestoning.

SPEAKER_04 29:01

My keychain, and I had to hide my computer, my laptop. So that was.

SPEAKER_00 29:05

I rhinestoned Michael's rafter key. Luckily, it was just a spare. I am I'm gonna hide your normal key so that you have to take the rhinestone key one day. Anyway, so I'm sitting there rhinestoning, and all of a sudden I see Michael like walk past. I'm like, what are you doing? He's holding like 30 pound weights in each hand.

SPEAKER_04 29:26

35 pounders, right? Sorry, 35 pounders. Yeah, don't go lower.

SPEAKER_00 29:31

So in Shannon's house, there's one basement staircase, but there's two staircases to the upper, to the upper level. So he would walk up the basement stairs, and then he would walk up the upstairs, and then he'd walk across the upstairs and walk down the other side of stairs. And he'd probably like five times as I'm sitting there watching Scandal Rhinestoning, and I was like, What are you doing? And then he'd go back in the basement and he was watching the hockey game on like our movie theater screen, and all of a sudden I would hear him be like, No, and I went running down there because I thought, like, so I was like, Michael, don't give yourself a heart attack. Like, you have to be careful.

SPEAKER_04 30:12

Well, I was yelling at the hockey game. Utah Mammoth had it one.

unknown 30:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 30:17

They're up a goal with under a minute to go. And uh Vegas pulled their goalie extra man, they scored a goal with like fifth 50 seconds, forced overtime, it went to double overtime, and then Vegas scored a short-handed goal in the second overtime.

SPEAKER_00 30:35

I don't know what any of those are. But anyway, so I went running down because I was like, oh my gosh, like, did he hurt himself? Like, no, he was just watching the hockey game. And then I'd see him come back up the stairs and go up the stairs and make a big thing.

SPEAKER_04 30:49

I know you scared me when you went running down.

SPEAKER_00 30:51

Well, you scared me. Oh, I threw my rhinestoning. I was like, Michael!

SPEAKER_02 30:56

No, that is what they sometimes I feel bad for Mike because he can't say one little thing. If like he says something doesn't feel right at all, then he has five women surrounding him. Freaky, are you okay?

SPEAKER_00 31:11

Should we should we rehash why?

SPEAKER_04 31:14

Yeah, I've got a couple of stories to tell about Zach here, so that reminds me. We were down at Parcell's Rachel's in-laws in uh for Rachel's birthday, January 14th, 2024. We're watching the Rams and I think Detroit, great NFL game. And I wasn't feeling great, kind of a little bit of a headache and a little bit of nausea. And at one time, I think I kind of did something like that, and I leaned back and Zach, it was you.

SPEAKER_02 31:45

I know, it was me. I apologize.

SPEAKER_04 31:47

You saw me and noticed something, and Mike, what's and then it was on.

SPEAKER_00 31:52

No, he then I he told Megan he was like he was like, I think there's something wrong with your dad. And Megan was like, What?

SPEAKER_02 31:59

And then we were all like I I would not have said something usually, but I saw your face and I was like, Yeah, Michael, you were white as a sold me out. No, that was the one time, but I think it was for good cause.

SPEAKER_00 32:15

Yeah, because then me and Shannon that night on our way home, he was like, No, I'm fine, I'm fine, I feel fine. And we were like, No, we're taking you to the hospital.

SPEAKER_04 32:24

No, I I put Drew's brother, Tyler, he had an Apple Watch and I put it on, ran the thing, and said, No.

SPEAKER_02 32:30

EKG, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 32:31

Yeah, EK, everything's fine. And then, kind of like this podcast, Against My Will, Shannon and Amy kidnapped me, stopped into the ER in Lehigh just on the way home, Against My Will.

SPEAKER_00 32:45

And we get there, and uh And I will say, even the doctor kind of thought me and Shannon were crazy. He was like, he's probably not having a heart attack. Like, look at him, he's fine, he's cracking jokes, he's laughing, he's not like his arm's not in pain. Like, but then the longer they did the is it an EKG or is it an echo?

SPEAKER_02 33:07

EKG. I I don't know. I think EKG was it on the watch, but and that that wasn't showing anything, I don't think.

SPEAKER_04 33:15

But they were drawing blood.

SPEAKER_00 33:18

They did like the two-hour test. What is that called?

SPEAKER_04 33:20

It's the protein test. Uh, what's the protein called that there's a protein marker that shows up in your blood that's indicative of a heart attack?

unknown 33:30

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 33:30

That's such an ugly. It was a minor heart incident.

SPEAKER_00 33:33

No, Michael, it was a heart attack.

SPEAKER_04 33:36

Yeah. You guys are so negative.

SPEAKER_00 33:38

The doctor came in and he was like, You guys were right, he had a heart attack.

SPEAKER_04 33:42

And if so it went from like six to twelve to fifty. At fifty, they said, uh, we got something going on. The next one was 500, and I don't remember from there. And they said, No, you're not going anywhere.

SPEAKER_00 33:56

Yeah. And the so then the doctor came in and was like, I know like we both kind of thought these girls were crazy, but like they just saved your life. And then all of a sudden I see Michael, and he like had his cute little tears in his eyes, and I was like, Well, Shannon, when we got there, Shannon kind of goes prancing into the Oh my gosh, she does her like little shuffles.

SPEAKER_04 34:18

Chest pains. We we have chest pains, so they were ready to put her on a gurney.

SPEAKER_02 34:22

Yeah, it's about being good. That is the funniest part.

SPEAKER_00 34:26

Her shuffle walking in, she's like, chest pains, chest pains, holding her Chanel.

SPEAKER_04 34:30

And I was like, Oh so public service announcement. If you have a broken arm or I don't know, dislocated shoulder and you want to go right to the front of the line in the ER, just chest pains. We have chest pains, but even the line.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

Shannon told me this even if you go to like the urgent care and like whatever. She's like, if you want to get seen quick and you're not sitting in that waiting room for hours, you say you can't breathe, and your chest hurts, and they take you right back.

SPEAKER_04 34:58

But I I never I I didn't have chest pains, though.

SPEAKER_00 35:01

But Shannon didn't care. She knew you had chest pains.

SPEAKER_04 35:04

Yeah, I might have waited there for three hours, had I had not done that.

SPEAKER_02 35:09

So yeah, true. And but that was the one time I'll sell you out. That was you sold me out, and that was for the cause.

SPEAKER_04 35:17

Here's another Zach story. Uh it was like the no, well, we had met Zach. Uh, this would have been early June of 2019. You and Megan had made the connection. I know you've told the story, but I'm gonna tell the rest of the story. I don't know if you have any any boomer podcast listeners, but Paul Harvey, great radio commentator, would always tell I don't even know who that is the rest of the story. Uh YouTube and love Paul Harvey.

SPEAKER_00 35:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 35:45

So the rest of the story, um, Megan and Zach had been dating for a couple of weeks. Well, so this was late June, June 26, 2019. So it's my birthday. So I'm making Taylor and Drew go to basketball night in America. We've had this game going since 2006 at uh the Stake Center. My friend Todd has a key to I think every gym in the county, so we always have a place to play. But so I said, Megan, you gotta have Zach come play. Now he's in between his junior and senior years of playing basketball at Brown, and his father, I hope the Statute of Limitations is over. I hope you never told your dad, but I said, You can't tell coach and you can't tell Coach Martin back at Brown, but come play basketball tonight. And so Zach did. If he would have sprained an ankle, coach would have shot me, and probably you too. Yeah, anyway, but it it went fine.

SPEAKER_02 36:48

Zach, you know, I I passed enough. I passed enough to get the job done.

SPEAKER_04 36:54

You stole you stole my punchline. Ah no. So so it's uh yeah, me and Zach, Drew and Taylor, and they're both six five people, and then my friend Todd, we played on the same team, and you know, but anyway, so we we played, had had fun, had some good games. Uh but after we left, I'm driving home, and this is like 11 o'clock, and Megan's at our house, and I called Megan. I said, Megan, you you're in trouble. But I I I really like the Zach character. I said, first of all, you know, I don't know if it's the Ivy League education or what it is, but he is a smart, smart guy. He's oh really? Megan's saying, well, what why why do you how do you know? Why do you say that? Well, he passed the ball to me all night. He he was feeding me, and I don't think I had scored so many points in 15 years. So I said, This is a smart young man, so you don't don't screw it up, Megan.

SPEAKER_02 37:50

Yes. I I had no plans on scoring that night. My plan was to get you to like me so I could uh marry Megan. But the funny thing is, I did go home and tell my dad about it. I think it was that night. Oh no, and then was he mad?

SPEAKER_04 38:06

I'm shocked I didn't get a call from coach.

SPEAKER_02 38:08

I think I've told you this, but after I told him about it, I was like, Yeah, I definitely passed the ball a lot that night because he asked me, like, you scored a lot, you know, he always does. And I was like, No, I definitely passed it a lot, especially to Megan's dad. And he's like, You're such a kiss ass. I was like, you know, gotta do what you gotta do.

SPEAKER_04 38:28

Yeah, you know, and I I I told Megan, you're you're a very, very smart kid, bright kid, and then your dad's comments that's funny.

SPEAKER_02 38:39

Yeah, but no, that that that was worth it. That was worth it.

SPEAKER_04 38:43

So I yeah, I I started uh ratcheting down the credit card usage, and um I I don't remember if I told Megan that night, but in my mind, in my heart, I said, We're in trouble. Megan's gonna marry this punk kid.

SPEAKER_00 38:59

Yeah, Michael Michael started pinching those pennies to get he knew he was getting another wedding.

SPEAKER_04 39:05

Had to throw a reception. Okay, second story. You guys told the story of the Draper dads. I hatched this plan a number of years ago to uh get us into the uh Draper City rec basketball league so I could play ball with my son-in-laws. Two were here. I think the first year it was Drew and Taylor. Zach, why'd you go? Oh, you went uh blurry for a minute. DC.

SPEAKER_00 39:30

Oh yeah, I'm still good.

SPEAKER_02 39:31

I can still hear you. You're good.

SPEAKER_00 39:32

It's it'll go blurry for a second and then it's fine.

SPEAKER_04 39:35

Okay, and then the second year, you guys had moved back after COVID shut down your senior year, and and so Megan and Zach both finished their college degree from our kitchen table. Yes. Uh, you know, back from Brown, and then Megan finished up her last couple of online courses at BYU from our kitchen table. But um, so that second year, I made Zach play. He had some knee issues, and I think got surgery part way through that year or right after. But we did well, and and Zach would kind of, you know, a lot of passing, not a lot of scoring. But this one game in particular, there were these punk kids. I think you've told the story, they for some reason thought it would was, I don't know what they thought, but they started trash talking Zach specifically early in the game, and there might have been a few words exchanged and words with one of their mothers, and and so Zach starts going off. But anyway, the bottom line that night Zach and I combined for 52 points in the game, and we won. Was it overtime? I might have been. Did it go to overtime? I think it might have been. Yeah, and so it took all of that, but anyway, the the real story is Zach scored 50, I scored two, I got a layup, and guess who assisted on my layup? Zacharias.

SPEAKER_02 41:01

Yes, there you go.

SPEAKER_04 41:03

Calls him.

SPEAKER_02 41:03

Yeah, I was I left that game a little worried after to be honest, because I had let a little too many words slip, and I was like, oh man, my father-in-law just heard all of that.

SPEAKER_00 41:12

Are you kidding? Michael. We won the game.

SPEAKER_04 41:15

Uh so and I I I had to go over and check the scorebook after, which I never do, but I took a picture of it. I still got it. It's a little bit blurry, but Zach hit 10 two-pointers and 10 three-pointers. Not a single free throw. They couldn't catch up to him to even foul him, I guess. But 10 twos and 10 threes equals 50 points, and then I had my two points. I was one for one.

SPEAKER_00 41:40

Slay Michael.

SPEAKER_04 41:41

And Zach Zach had one assist. So congratulations. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 41:45

And that's on teamwork.

SPEAKER_04 41:47

And without Zach scoring 50 that night, and Drew and Taylor, they probably had, I don't know, eight or ten, something like that. But without Zach scoring 50, we would have lost to these punks, and then you really would have been in trouble.

SPEAKER_02 41:59

I know. I know. Yeah, that one. Uh I'm glad that everyone got a had a good time listening. Because I actually was really worried. I was like, uh, I hope they don't. I hope Mike's not mad at me or you know, thinking twice.

SPEAKER_00 42:12

Oh, are you kidding? He loved it. That's like his favorite story.

SPEAKER_02 42:15

I'm glad the ref didn't hear.

SPEAKER_04 42:17

He would have booted you. Oh, well. And then we would have lost. Oh, I know he heard it a couple times because he was just laughing. He was well, he knew these punks deserved it. And these guys, they're what, 30 years younger than me.

SPEAKER_02 42:29

Yeah, they were young. They were like fresh out of high school. Yeah. But mouth is cocky.

SPEAKER_04 42:36

So we we we humbled them.

SPEAKER_02 42:38

Yeah. Good job. That was a good time. That was fun. So um, I guess going back to the girls, raising, raising the four daughters.

SPEAKER_04 42:48

Were you the gray hair? That's not work stress.

SPEAKER_02 42:52

Were you pretty strict with like Emily and Rachel growing up? And did you become you kind of mentioned you became softer? Or was it kind of the same? Because you you became you came from a more, as you mentioned, loose, kind of more kind of did what you want a little bit in your house growing up, and your mom and your dad not did what you want, but they had the rules, but kind of give you more freedom. Or like I came from a very, very strict household. Um but how were you with with the girls?

SPEAKER_04 43:21

Yeah, that's a good question. And there's no doubt we lightened up or loosened up a bit with the with the younger girls. Um and but yeah, so when I was growing up, you know, yeah, we had rules, not really a curfew, but there was expectations, and my biggest fear was disappointing my parents. Wouldn't do it. And so, you know, I knew where the line was and and you know, so kind of the philosophy that maybe evolved over a lot of time, you know, as parents, you kind of put up this wall that you know here's the line you don't you don't cross the line um but kids are gonna push against that wall and that's good that's healthy they need to push and they need to push on boundaries and and you know but know exactly where that wall's at then as the parents Shannon and I you know knew we had you know you have a united front and you don't budge on that you don't give a little and a little and and it moves off you know out of control but you you know united front you're together and uh you know you expect them you encourage them you allow them to push but you you don't give in and uh that wall maybe was a little bit softer when uh Megan and Amy but you know still very always very high expectation what's my favorite saying 100 100 oh yeah 100% and you know that never meant we expected uh them to get 100% on every test or to always be the winner in a dance competition or with Amy in soccer or volleyball but give a hundred percent effort and you know do your best didn't matter what you were doing if it was school a test uh sporting event dance competition just yeah do your best do it right have a good attitude about it uh prepare you know put the the time in the the time to win a dance competition isn't during the competition it's the year and years before that when you know I'd I drive Megan to uh up and over the mountain to Cedar Hills for a 6 a.m uh ballet private what three three times a week I think I don't remember when it was sophomore year junior year something like that um another little trick I learned uh you know we're encouraged to do family scripture study family prayer we tried we probably failed more than we succeeded but you don't give up you keep trying and I don't know when we started this but uh you know early mornings I would have and Shannon and I would have what 30 to 40 minutes in our old house in Draper there was a big kind of an open loft area where all of the bedrooms the girls' bedrooms were at and they had a great big uh full height mirror and they would all sit there and get ready together sharing makeup and sharing clothes sometimes arguing over who got to wear what that day and and but I knew I I had about a 30 or 45 minute uh captive audience and uh so you know we'd get up early we'd go up and just sit down in that loft and read scriptures family prayer and I think that was that was very meaningful. You know I don't know if they could quote a single passage of scripture we didn't memorize but you know we read we spent spent time with the family.

SPEAKER_00 47:18

That's one of my favorite memories from high school especially when we would like get to like the boring chapters like um like the hard ones that you always tell me to skip what is it like the Moses Isaiah chapters I'd like turn on the blow dryer is fabulous.

SPEAKER_04 47:35

We just got through studying Moses and the let my people go parting of the Red Sea in the Old Testament this year but yeah Isaiah's a little bit drier.

SPEAKER_00 47:44

So when we would get to the Isaiah chapters I'd like turn on the blow dryer thinking he'd like stop no he just got louder.

SPEAKER_02 47:52

No I I was actually planning to bring up this and what you would do because I think that I I remember hearing about that from Megan and I thought it was pretty cool.

SPEAKER_00 48:00

I mean that is some piece I think that's I think that's mine and Megan's favorite memory they talk about the blow dryer they they couldn't drown me out.

SPEAKER_04 48:09

No we could not and uh just be persistent and uh you figure out what works for your family it's gonna look different for almost every family but that's what we figured you know dinner time or late at night especially when the older girls got into high school that was chaos and everybody coming and going all that that never would have worked so that that's what we came up with and it was good.

SPEAKER_02 48:38

Yeah it was Michael is stuck with them so that was that's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_04 48:44

Now on our our Sunday family dinners and usually I can get three minutes maybe for to have just a quick lesson a quick scripture or less you know applying the scriptures to our lives and try to teach the uh the grandsons and I'm still hoping my uh daughters and son-in-laws listen in a little bit maybe it's something we learned at church that Sunday or through uh you know study during the week or Shannon will bring something up that maybe we learned in uh gospel doctrine Sunday school class or relief society that she learned so we try to you know always incorporate that a little bit without without overdoing it if you try to sit down hey we're gonna have a one hour Sunday afternoon scripture study that's you know take take the little uh bites that you can in a on a road trip too you can get a little bit of that in as well yeah Michael loves to take over on a road trip he and because like he's like they can't go anywhere they're trapped captive audience it's great it's a good he'll go off he'll give us like a little sermon if you will and then he'll play music he'll either play like his gospel library music some good stuff and then he'll move on to music is yeah yeah great stuff then he'll move on to like his Michael's running playlist which has a plethora the most eclectic uh music collection ever assembled yeah no Amy helps me that's funny so Michael and I share Apple music and sometimes when I get in my car I'll just hit shuffle and like sometimes it's like one direction and like Cardi B and then the next song it's like some opera guy that's like Italian I'm like Pavarotti.

SPEAKER_00 50:39

Like what is this?

SPEAKER_04 50:41

And it's in Dorma.

SPEAKER_00 50:42

That's what he listens to when he works out and when he runs I'm like how come on and then Eminem right after that. Yeah no it is like so it's like all over the board.

SPEAKER_04 50:53

I mean that's why you gotta have it though you you need to you need to mix it up when you're running you need to surprise yourself a little bit that's right or or then I would launch into uh US history uh Civil War Revolutionary War World War II I love US history and so I and my my biggest disciplinary uh what method or something on a road trip was museums that hey girls if you're not behaving yourself there's a museum in this next town we are going to stop and tour this museum maybe it was an old I don't know a pioneer museum or or Indian artifact museum we need to carry this we need to do this again on like a next family vacation they they would straighten up Jack you haven't been on a road trip with me but no I I like this museum idea I think that that'd be kind of funny to see all of them in the museum.

SPEAKER_00 51:52

Yeah I actually I actually love museums now like I love going to Europe and I love going to all of the museums and stopping and reading everything. And actually my favorite is when we get a tour guide and they have the little microphone and headphones and they just like tell you all about it.

SPEAKER_04 52:11

No I'm I'm the tour guide.

SPEAKER_00 52:13

Yeah but when I was just in Europe you weren't with me and so we had a tour guide and it is my favorite thing and some people really don't like that which is fine. Like Drew he's not a big Europe fan he'd rather go to the beach or like go to the pool but Emily Taylor and I when we were in Paris a couple years ago at the Louvre were you in the Louvre? We were at the Louvre we went to just like everywhere we tried to go to Notre Dame but it was they were still reconstructing it whatever it's re belt now I've I've got to go back.

SPEAKER_04 52:48

Let's go Michael let's go I gotta go to Normandy we can just happen to swing by Paris for a day but yeah gotta go to Normandy see Omaha Beach Utah Beach.

SPEAKER_02 53:00

We have to it'd be cool um okay so let's go to the daughters in when they started a date and get married oh I thought you were gonna make me rank the daughters you you ranked the uh we should do that we can we can that's a great idea I think that's gonna cost some battles let's not bad idea let's not do that for the sake of a number of FaceTime calls tonight let's uh let's skip the ranking good idea so did you care a lot about who they were dating and of course what were you looking for in the guys that they were bringing back to meet the family oh like during high school or after let's do college after when they're actually starting to like really date seriously oh I don't know I I do remember I don't think I have a specific memory of the first time we met Taylor but Drew I remember Rachel invited him to a BYU basketball game that we you know we watched and then we're walking out and I remember this distinct and I well no I don't think I said it out loud right then but I had this distinct impression that this punk thinks he's gonna marry my daughter and I had met him just that night it knew nothing about him or his family but but you know that turned out to be great as we got to know Drew and and his family and everything and hit Drew and and his father who uh unfortunately passed away from uh cancer how long ago two two years ago yeah but Drew's father Walt Walt and I were very close.

SPEAKER_04 54:51

Uh Walt is the one that you know when I gave up one bad habit which was golfing Walt Parcell got me into another bad habit uh running and you know we trained together uh ran several marathons and half marathons together uh the Utah Valley marathon St. George and uh quite a few of them um Emily and I did the uh New York City marathon while uh Emily somehow got me in on her coattails but uh anyway so what was your question oh what was I looking for um you know a gentleman somebody that would treat my daughters right treat him like gold uh you know somebody that had a plan for their future that wasn't just in the basement playing video games and and other worse things online uh but you know good family uh you know strong in the restored gospel of Jesus Christ that's that's very very important so any potential suitors daters of Amy uh make notes yes exactly I will say and all of the guys that I like talked to or dated you always like kind of stayed on the outskirts like you were always like yeah like cool you're going out with this guy or like whatever there was only one guy that you ever were like I don't think you should date him and I don't even I don't ever think I asked you yeah I don't ever think I even asked you why but the second the second you said it because like mom and Emily and Rachel and Megan were like I don't think you should date him and I was like no I really like him like pipe down type of thing and then when you said something I was like okay and I like cut it off immediately and I just like I never even looked back and I think that's the only guy you ever were like I don't think you should date him I mean I do feel like yeah since your dad doesn't really get involved too much because you're there's already so many people with so many voices chitter chattering.

SPEAKER_02 57:14

I try to fly above the fray above the drama I'm I'm a drama free zone so then to have have him come in and say no that's probably a a good yeah good advice to take. Yeah now Zach if you would have scored 50 points that first night on my birthday basketball night in America and it's just pickup games instead of passing to me red flag I think you would do the red flag green flag thing yeah that would have been a red flag I'm a John Stockton uh huge fan Stockton to Malone and in fact when Stockton announced his retirement I think he's only a year older than me but I had my girls convinced that the jazz were gonna call me to replace Stockton despite my complete lack of talent um but and then I think Amy especially would come home dad did the jazz call today did they call I know Megan really believed it too she would tell me about it yeah yeah that's funny um I mean we're just gonna keep moving through the the whole lives then what happened when they started to get this social media following I mean I haven't actually talked to you or Shannon much about that.

SPEAKER_04 58:28

How I feel like that would have been a weird thing to watch with your daughters getting a lot of Shannon saw the vision immediately or maybe maybe not the full vision but fully supportive uh she would go out she would take the pictures and help with the outfits uh hit the credit card buy the outfits and and supported her daughters uh which she's always done no matter what they were doing and you know I think Rachel kind of led out in that and her friends at high school in high school or beyond would or maybe when she was first married uh you know Rachel she's out taking pictures and posting outfits on which she's crazy but you know Shannon supported it I and you know I went I was a bit of a professional photographer. Yes yeah but uh no Rachel I I think Rachel fired me many times yeah because you you want to get her shoes you'd cut off the shoes yeah I always like to zoom in and yeah I'd miss the shoes and that's part of the whole outfit but yeah I mean you just try to support them and I remember uh my younger brother Pete who he's an NBA uh what's the Arizona uh is that Thunderbird yeah Thunderbird school uh NBA out of Arizona I remember he was over one night and this is very early on and and uh I think uh Rachel was there and Emily was maybe just starting to do some things and we had this long in-depth com conversation about uh monetization strategies of uh this very early social media uh thing and just what Rachel especially was doing and and you know I I wish we would have had a uh a video recorder going or a phone going to record that that was probably what 2010 2012 I don't I don't remember somewhere way back in there that's cool and so that was kind of like the real conversation that led to monetizing and the the strategy for growing yeah and Rachel I would say really just jumped in figured things out on her own and uh you know our favorite story to tell is uh was it I think it was Drew that said Rachel why don't you go get a job at Happy Sumo yeah go go see if Happy Sumo is hiring or Nordstrom I think he told the story here that Happy Sumo didn't hire Nordstrom didn't hire her and then a number of years later she's got her own uh dress line uh and Emily as well uh being sold exclusively at Nordstrom and uh but yeah you do you try to support them in their dreams and whatever they're wanting to do I'm trying really hard to support the maimes I was just gonna segue this how do you feel about my dream with my horsiness I'm trying to be supportive the horse is the cheap part it's the diesel pickup and the horse trailer and the vet bills and the feed and the uh stable and all of that that that you can just goes on. So I this horse is uh probably a uh unfortunately a Michael and Shannon and Amy joint venture.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:05

Yes I love our joint ventures Michael it's so much fun well we sold one of you and your mother's joint ventures yesterday had closing on the Lehigh home yes went to a great family who will enjoy that home for many years but uh yeah that joint venture cost me a lot of money yeah you win some you lose some Michael right I mean true I will say coming in control in your eyes yeah yeah what did you see from your perspective from my perspective in the family I mean I'm always shocked at just like how positive you all are if someone has like something they want to do I think I just have more of a negative perception it's always looking for like oh why is this not going to work you all are all right you want to do this like let's go make this happen what do we need to do what can we do to work make make this work together I mean for example the podcast like I was I was a little embarrassed to do this at the beginning you know still some half he was like even scared to like ask me and Emily to do it like Megan had to call and be like would you guys like want to do this Megan do your dirty work and we were like yeah why not let's do it like who cares well I had no I had talked to Emily before before I had Megan do it. And I talked to you too but it was got to the point where we needed to actually do it and I was like you guys actually do this and that's where I was a little more like okay Megan maybe you step in and ask but no you guys are extremely as far as Mike and Shannon it's very like supportive if you want to do it if you have a passion for it go make it happen. And I don't think there's a lot of people I don't know I I feel like more people are more skeptical especially trying to go do something that's like different for example Rachel doing social media I feel like a lot of people would have had oh like go get the job at Happy Sumo or Nordstrom and maybe do this on the side and see you know you know we'll see if it works the safe thing to do but yeah exactly looking back in hindsight no that no so I think that's I think that's cool. And I think also that's instilled a lot of confidence in them like I that's also one thing from the outside looking in all four of them are very just self-assured confident in themselves like don't really care about what they do you know when other people like the impact or people saying things about them.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:36

Yeah hopefully they've learned to ignore the haters on yeah whatever online there's always haters yeah yeah I I saw something the other day that you know it said don't worry about negative comments uh even the grand canyon gets negative comments and it pulled up like half a dozen you know one oh it's it's not that grand or I'm I'm not impressed with rocks you know it's it's the Grand Canyon people and I've I've done the rim to rim hike through the Grand Canyon it is spectacular there's still detractor you're always gonna have detractors the Grand Canyon doesn't worry about it so girls don't worry about it just move forward it and how do you think you installed that confidence in them uh I I don't know if there's anything specific uh their their mother I I give lots of credit most of the credit majority of the credit to uh Shannon on raising these girls I was working and you know with Kiwit long hours even post Kiwit uh you know on the development side once we acquired uh Doc instruction group uh you know very very busy but not so busy that I neglected my family I was there but you know Shannon's the one there that's there all the time Time, but I don't know, maybe just encouraging them to uh go after whatever they wanted, not not to quit, don't give up. Um and uh yeah, just trying to be positive and encourage them, you know, even when they're getting some uh negatives even from family members and things like what in the world? You just you know, hey, figure it out, keep keep going.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:26

Yeah, that's cool. Um Amy, any any questions that you had for your dad? Anything or did anyone write anything in?

SPEAKER_00 1:06:35

Oh, I didn't even look. Um I was just gonna say, do you feel like because you're an entrepreneur, an entrepreneuse, like that's what like, or do you think it didn't matter like what you did, even if you worked like a corporate nine to five, like say you would have stayed with Kiwit instead of leaving and starting your own thing? Do you feel like you would have still had that mentality of like you can go out and do anything? Or because you had already like you already took the huge risk of starting your own business, leaving a company. What is that noise?

SPEAKER_04 1:07:12

I don't know. What is it?

SPEAKER_00 1:07:14

Or I can hear somebody like like clicking or tapping or something like that.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:18

Is it this chair?

SPEAKER_00 1:07:19

I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:20

Anyway, I don't know. Keep going.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:22

Um like do you feel like that's because like you already had like taken the risk and it like was successful that you were like yeah, I did it, so why can't you? Or do you feel like that's just like how your parents raised you?

SPEAKER_04 1:07:37

I think we were probably raised with I with an entrepreneurial spirit. I I don't I didn't even learn that word until I don't know when, 2000s. But yeah, we started businesses, like I mentioned, the lawn, lawn business, paper routes, and uh, you know, we we painted houses in high school. Uh we did all all kinds of things to earn money, and so maybe that's where it came from a little bit. I hadn't really thought about that, but uh yeah, then kind of starting other things, uh, you know, kind of a second career. Um yeah, you jump in, you work hard, and uh, you know, a lot of times, sometimes it takes 20 plus years to become an overnight success. But you know, you you kind of embrace the grind and you grind, and and maybe while some others would have given up on a certain business or something, you you just keep plowing through. I'm always been a glass half full or mostly full kind of person. Try to you know look at the positives and how how can we figure this out? How can we make it work?

SPEAKER_00 1:08:56

Slide.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:58

Um, all right. Last little, I guess we're gonna do a little segment to end. I'm gonna read it's like a quick rapid fire. I'll I'll say like you'll see, and you're just gonna answer with which daughter, which daughter fits the question.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:14

Zach, you're determined to get me in trouble.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:16

No, these are easy. These won't be bad. These aren't bad. Who do you who would you say is the most like you? The most like me?

SPEAKER_04 1:09:28

Depends on in which way I think each of the four have taken on different, you know, certain traits from me, from Shannon, from each other, from four fabulous grandparents that set great examples and had high expectations. So I yeah, give me one.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:53

Uh I think I I have my answer.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:57

Somebody once said uh well, I I I think a lot of people say Emily looks the most like me. That's not very nice to say about Emily, but then also there was some hater online that like for a while there was this thing going on on online that Emily is an illegitimate love child.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:20

Yes, that is true. That's a rumor.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:22

And wow, and then but at the same time, people would say she looks the most like me. Yeah, that's so yeah. I don't know. I I would say calm, cool, and collected, Megan.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:33

Yeah, I'd agree with that.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:35

My Magy Dog, drama-free, mostly drama-free. The her sisters dragged her into some drama. They've successfully dragged you into some drama. Yes, they have, yes, they have an episode. So but overall, the most I I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:51

Yeah. Next. Biggest warrior. Like worries about things.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:58

Oh, I thought you were talking about warrior, like gonna go to battle for you.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:03

Warrior. Warrior, not warrior. Amy? Oh, really? Who would you say? I don't know. I actually don't know about this one.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:14

But Amy sometimes can kind of get a little bit not paralyzed, but oh what if what if this happened? Well, what if it doesn't?

SPEAKER_02 1:11:27

Like it's true. He always tells me that he's like Does that lead to the ghosting or to like the kind of pulling away from things? Amy?

SPEAKER_00 1:11:36

Yeah, yeah, like a detachment, it's like a mechan defense mechanism almost.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:42

Kind of disengage, which not good. We've had lots of chats about that. You jump right on. And you know what's the worst that could happen? I agree. You know, whatever it is.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:55

That's true. It's so true, Michael.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:57

And if you kind of consider what's the worst that could happen, then okay, it's gotta be better than that. And it might be off the charts fabulous. You might you might get 100%.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:10

It's true, it's very true.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:12

It's true. Most likely to call for your help.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:16

Uh Amy and then Emily. Yeah. Close. And I don't remember if you talked about the uh the call from Amy. I got dad, I'm in jail. Come and uh bail me out.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:31

So iconic.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:32

I I fell for that. I didn't panic, but said, well, all right, we'll figure it out.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:37

I'll uh Michael you did panic.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:41

I didn't panic. I said, what in the age, why why didn't you pay your dang tickets? It serves you right. I don't blame them for arresting. But then in my defense, like six months later, uh similar call from Amy. The first call, it somehow showed up on my phone caller ID, uh, Utah County Sheriff or incarceration or something. I fell for that, but later, call from Amy with the same cry voice, Dad, I'm pregnant, and I did not fall for that for even one tenth of one second. I said, No, no, you're not. Quit messing with me.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:21

Yeah, he was like, I'm in me. Don't call me again. Yeah, you want to know who did fall for that though?

SPEAKER_04 1:13:27

Shannon fell for it.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:28

Well, Shannon fell for it. For a little while. And actually, Shannon was like, Wait, really? Like, okay, like we could totally do this.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:35

Shannon was happy. We're at nine, nine grandkids in holding. Let's get going, Zach.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:42

But but Megan fell for it, and that actually was the first time Megan had ever said the F-word. Out.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:50

No, she didn't. No, I was there. Megan, I don't.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:54

That was crazy. Megan, stop. That was their that was her first time ever saying it because of Amy.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:02

So Amy and Zach are both bad influences. That's true.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:06

That's true. But yeah, that one was funny. And I think that actually was said a lot about what Amy uh Megan thought about you because she did believe it. Well, yeah, and your mother believed it?

SPEAKER_00 1:14:18

Not or it wasn't so much about me. It's because I used to just came in. I used the guy that I was like talking to at the time, and they know him, and they were like, Yeah, I could see like him knocking you up. It was more so the guy.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:36

I don't even remember who you were.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:38

Well, we're not gonna name them, but we'll talk about it after.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:41

You can tell me later.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:43

But I will give it to Amy. She is a great actress. She's she can pull it off.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:49

Has she pranked you, Zach?

SPEAKER_00 1:14:51

I haven't tried maybe. I haven't pulled any pranks lately because one, I'm terrified of Shannon because she always says, if I prank you, I'm gonna give you a heart attack. I don't want to give you another heart attack. So I don't know. I'm trying to think of something that I could do.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:08

Well, and Amy came to work with me and for me right after the minor heart incident. Her job description from Shannon is to keep my blood pressure down and not not add to the uh stress, but to take away the stress. We can hear Shannon whispering.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:28

What is she saying?

SPEAKER_04 1:15:30

Doing a great job. That's funny.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:33

Um, can I say what I won't name the tenant, but can I say what one of the tenants said? Like literally, this was like two days after Michael had his heart attack. We were in a design meeting. It's like this massive tenant of ours.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:47

Yeah, they're in. You can say the tenant.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:49

Yeah, yeah, they're locked in now. Um, so we're in the meeting, we're designing their space plan, we're getting an update from all of like our subs and our contractors of if we're on time, what's the next schedule, like, what's going in next. And the guy, he's like, Oh, where's Mike? And I'm like, Oh, he actually had a heart attack, unfortunately. So like, I'll kind of like be stepping in his place for the next couple weeks. And he looked me dead in my face and goes, Well, this isn't gonna affect the timeline, is it?

SPEAKER_03 1:16:26

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:27

I literally I and mind you, mind you, they'd forgotten about that.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:33

That was that's a different tenant than the one I was thinking of.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:36

No, they changed their mind every five seconds, so the only people affecting the timeline was them.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:42

Yeah, and I we didn't miss a beat, we never miss a schedule.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:46

No, we're always in fact, we're always ahead of schedule. But I looked at him and I said, the timeline won't be affected unless you keep changing your mind.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:56

You say, Wow, good for you.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:59

First of all, like don't piss me off, and second of all, don't piss me off when it comes to Michael.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:05

He just had a heart attack, and that's the first thing he said.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:07

If you want to bring out warrior girls, who was it? Zina, the princess warrior, and Amy. Uh, come after me. And yeah, Amy's gonna go to battle.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:21

Yeah, I'm very protective over Michael.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:24

Sometimes too protective. You drive me crazy.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:27

That's actually true. Perfect transition for my last two questions. All right. What is something about Amy people don't see? Uh, can I phone a friend, Shannon?

SPEAKER_00 1:17:40

Michael! Come on, dig deep in those big feelings of yours.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:46

Oh, I don't like feelings, especially. Yeah, these last two are a little more touchy-feely. Oh man. That's not my strong point. Um, uh, get over the RBF. People need to see through that. It's uh, I think it's a natural, it's not uh something she does intentionally, but it's it's not real. She's uh very sweet, very tenderhearted, do anything for anybody, which all three of her sisters, well, and me, I don't, and her mother, I don't think any of us would would uh well, I mean, yeah, we'd survive, but wouldn't wouldn't be uh maybe as thriving uh mentally or you know Amy, you bail out your sisters constantly. You're uh you're Rachel's emo emotional support animal or sister?

SPEAKER_00 1:18:42

Blanket.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:43

We've got blanket emotional support blanket since she lost Teresa.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:47

Yeah, it's true.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:50

So yeah, Amy bails us out of lots of jams. I get jammed up, and hey, I gotta have you go handle this meeting or handle whatever it is. So and she'll she'll jump in and help.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:03

I would agree. I feel like Amy's kind of the glue of everything.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:06

Yeah. Yeah, glue for the family.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:08

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:09

She has a great relationship with all three of her brother-in-laws, and uh she can I think she she and Megan both can be pretty good uh mediators when there's some drama blowing up. Oh, speaking on bring the piece.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:26

We gotta talk about the fight because people really want to know about no, we don't we don't speak.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:30

That's that's in the circle, in the what is it? The circle family vault.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:35

Yeah, yep. We just know they made up, that's all that matters.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:39

Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:40

Um, last thing, last question. What do you hope your daughters would say about you? At my funeral? No, just right now.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:49

No, right now.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:51

Uh I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:55

That you have to answer that too. What you have to say something nice.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:59

Well, how much time do we have? I could sit here for hours.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:03

You got two minutes after.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:04

Okay, I gotta go first, but so that I would hope all four would say, Hey, my dad loved loved us all, loved me, supported me, and was a uh big cheerleader and wasn't wasn't too tough on him. I I try to be tough, and I'm a at the end of the day, I'm a wimp.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:25

When it comes to your family, you're not tough. We can hear Shannon whispering, what is she saying?

SPEAKER_04 1:20:30

What did you say?

SPEAKER_00 1:20:32

I said you're a softy, not a wimp.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:34

Softy, all right. That's a better word. Softy.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:37

Yeah, when it comes to his family, unless you do something to make any of us mad or to hurt us, then that's when the claws come out with Michael. Yeah, then he says, You're dead wrong. That's my favorite Michael quote. You're dead wrong.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:54

Yeah, that's a rare occurrence.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:56

Or the grandkids, don't don't do not mess with those grandkids. My grandkids that's sure. Not pass the basketball to the bear or to cannon.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:08

Or great gray.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:09

Or the gray, especially, uh, not I shouldn't say especially, don't not pass the ball to the baller. Yeah, that's gray, gray baller. And then we got the bear, we got canon. And then we got uh young 40 just starting to play some soccer and football, no basketball yet. Then we're gonna have uh Deany and Wesse coming up. They're golfers and fishermen.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:32

That's right.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:33

And soccer, Dean's playing some soccer, so there's a lot more uh athletic sporting events as a uh grandpapa. And you know, growing up or the girls growing up, it was mostly dance, a little bit of soccer and volleyball for Amy, which was a great change. But the best thing I, you know, Shannon, we can pick and choose what we go to as a father. Man, you you better make every effort to be present for just about everything.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:09

But uh as a grandfather Michael, you're there for everything, you're at every game.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:17

We we go to a lot, but not everything. Well, last Saturday I hit seven.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:21

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:22

Seven uh between basketball, flag football. I don't think it's it's a blur. That's why it's all a blur, but I don't think there was any soccer last week. There'll probably be soccer this Saturday.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:35

It's a lot, so all right, Amy give us give us your thoughts on your dad.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:43

Thank you so much for coming on. We really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:46

Against my will, but I survived.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:48

Do you have a quote, a favorite Michael ism, if you will, to end the podcast with? Come on, give us a quote. Look in your notes.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:00

I had to start keeping notes. I don't even remember where it's at. It's probably down.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:04

Michael, we gotta bring back quotes by Michael. The people cry out for quotes by Michael.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:09

I do love the quotes by Michael.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:11

If you go running with me, then we'll bring it back.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:17

I don't like running.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:20

She'll trot on the horse next to you as you're running.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:22

Yeah, me and me and Brazil will go running with you on the trails.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:27

I don't know. I've I've just looking at the start of the notes, I've I've used a lot of these. Oh, here's one. I I like uh it's the mariner's rule. Do you know what do you know what a mariner is?

SPEAKER_00 1:23:37

Like the like the baseball players?

SPEAKER_04 1:23:41

No, like a ship, captain of the ship. Oh mariner's rule. The captain is always right, and I'm the captain.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:48

Classic. That's a good one. That's a classic, Michael. You know what other quote is, classic, Michael?

SPEAKER_04 1:23:54

What?

SPEAKER_00 1:23:55

Expect problems and eat them for dinner.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:58

For breakfast.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:59

Breakfast, sorry. Yep.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:02

There's one. Uh are you going to curse the darkness or light a candle?

SPEAKER_00 1:24:07

So good.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:08

That's a good one. We spend too much time putting conditions on unconditional love.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:14

Aw, that's cute. I've never heard that one before. No.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:20

One more. The hardest thing is in life is not rising to battle, but rising with no battle to fight. You always gotta have a purpose. You gotta have a battle.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:31

I love it, Michael.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:32

It's good. Hey, me.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:35

All right. Well, thank you so much, Michael, for coming on Legally Friends, and thank you for ending us with amazing quotes. I'm sure the people will cry out for you to come back on. So listen for our call. You can find us anywhere you listen to podcasts, Apple, Spotify, YouTube. Please leave us a review and subscribe, and we will see you next week.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:58

Bye. Bye, podcast people.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:00

Okay, wait, don't, Michael, don't leave.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:02

Legally friends, you're related to us. Legally